box derailleur compatibility

When mixing and matching components one of the important factors to take into account is what size cogs the derailleur can precisely shift over and also if the derailleur has the ability to take up all the slack created by the chain on . This means that you can use an 8 -or 9-speed mountain bike derailleur with road shifters or vice versa. Found inside – Page 116... derailleur through the midrange, and the dimensions of these boxes delineate the schisms which define indexing compatibility. Where Campagnolo's box is ... See below, my comment on 10/11 Shimano MTB RDs. They are all (not just Shimano and SRAM) either silly, trying to “re-invent the wheel”, or (more likely in my opinion) trying to sell new, “revolutionary” equipment at all costs. Shimano MTB 11 speed RDs have the same movement ratio as SRAM 1:1 (according to my information). This setup is cheap, reliable and funky. Sram 11 speed GX and XX1 shifters have X-actuation cable pull. quite old 26in MTB I have this setup for about 4 years and it never let me down. (with colours, for instance to distinguish “official” compatibility and other degrees of compatibility). Went looking on wikibooks but couldn’t find them. MTB and road FDs generally aren’t a 1-1 match. Easiest to set up. I’m looking forward to seeing that bar, and hearing what combination you went with – and how well it performs. I bought the SRAM GX 11 speed shifter (X-Actuation) before reading this article. Third option/opinion: . Thank you. Doesn t need adjustments after short or long period of time. I am looking to upgrade a gravel bike combination and wonder if this will work. Are Box derailleurs compatible with Shimano "direct mount" hangers? From what I could gather (you’ve provided all the relevant info in the comment): 11 speed cassettes have different pitch, compared to the 10 speed ones (see the table in the cassette compatibility article). as I agree with pull ratio average. SRAM and Shimano 11 speed MTB RD movement ratio is 1.1. For that to work, RD movement ratio (name it M) would need to be: Shimano 105 11 speed road RD movement ratio is 1.4. This means there’s a new rear mech designed to handle 10-36-tooth cassettes. Hopefully within a month I’ll get it done – hectic schedule this summer. More expensive derailleurs often use harder wearing components and are built to closer tolerances, so will last longer than cheaper models. Rear shift ratio of this RD is about 1.2. The exception is eTap batteries, which work with all 12-speed AXS and 11-speed components, All 8- and 9-speed Campagnolo groupsets before mid-2001 used the same pull ratio and are compatible with each other. I plan on writing an article about the whole “upgrades” and “future proofing” topic. Keep in mind that shifters cable pull measurement can only be used to approximate with a rather large error and is only ok just for having an idea about it, because the err % is huge at that small dimension (unless you have extremely high end tools for measurement with very very good calibration ). Thank you for sharing your experience. TT frame, tiagra crankset double(I wanted 165mm with 48T, I couldn’t find anything else) stated only for 10 speed, I don’t understand why it cannot work with 11…is it for the chain thickness? Direct Channel Cable Stay. SRAM X0 9s shifter (1:1) It shifts uphill no problem. I found on Shimano support pages that : Mismatching either one will cause poor performance. Great article! There is a darkness moving over the land, obscuring hope, erasing freedom. Which Shimano 11 speed clutch-type MTB R.D. 2 SunRace MX60 10-11-12sp Rear Derailleur. Especially from 10 to 8 speeds. should be 3.95, so both 1.3 and 1.1 pull ratio are wrong or (most likely) your shifter cable pull data is wrong, SRAM 11s Road EA The friction clutch action feels very (SRAM) light but that's just a by-hand test on the showroom floor, not a trail examination.The Box derailleur retails for US$175 . Found insideThoroughly researched and revised, the 4th edition of the Big Blue Book contains updated photos, torque specifications and troubleshooting tables, along with new content on wheel building, electronic shifting, 12-speed and 1X drivetrains, ... For one example: while SRAM’s 1:1 (1.1 RD movement ratio) is a great improvement – making shifter cable less susceptible to any housing/cable imperfections (with a lot more cable pulled per shift), the X-Actuation 1.12 is just nonsense in my opinion – should have been made to fit the 1:1 standard, if it wasn’t for marketing and pushing people to buy new stuff. The latter note still doesn’t get close enough to work with both 10 and 11 speed. Exact Actuation but it didn’t seem to work. also I will consider SLX for future set! Do you think this might work? Shimano direct mount hangers are proprietary and are not compatible with Box derailleurs. The tested combo that did work, to my surprise, is Shimano’s. Found inside – Page 78It works hands free with a Bluetooth-compatible phone. ... TO USE" FOR DUMMIES The most difficult thing about using the Speed- zone was opening the box. Good question. The result: the easiest index shifting system to set up and it stays that way. It bears mentioning that the quoted capacity of derailleurs tends to be pretty conservative and, in practical terms, you could almost certainly get away with using a short length cage derailleur in this circumstance, so long as you avoided extreme (e.g. Rear shifter ratio is 1.3.Marketed as 10 speed road and MTB , as well as 11 speed road. They are compatible only with Shimano Dura Ace shifters from the same period (that is for 6, 7 and 8 speeds). The original eTap AXS Red and Force rear mechs are only rated up to 33-tooth cassettes. SRAM’s latest 12-speed eTap AXS road and MTB groupsets can be used together, setting up the option for ‘mullet builds’, which pairs up road shifters with an Eagle AXS rear mech and a 10-50 cassette, for an ultra-wide gravel bike build. As a general rule of thumb, it’s best not to mix and match drivetrain components from different brands. The choices seem to be extensive across both road and mtb and thus confusing! Thanks, was thinking of converting my road bike w/ drop bars to flat bar, I have a Sora 9 speed at rear and triple crankset w/ Sora FD at front, just want to know if Alivio shifters would be compatible as front & rear shifters. Will not these splines on the newest technology cassettes somehow interfere ? i had to file out the chainring to fit the middle position. Box Four 8 Speed Shifter Black. Writing down combinations that have worked and having easy to compare reference charts. Will a 9 speed alivio shifter work with deore 5120 rd, 10 speed cogs, and chain? A little grading down and the NX 12s set would be nice too. Including a Limited Slip Clutch, Sealed bearing pulleys and a solid construction Box Three Rear derailleurs are compatible with 11-46 derailleurs making it one of the most . – Chainline How bout for the sora FD? The . Thanks! SRAM has four RD families, with 4 different amounts of RD movement per cable movement (actuation ratios). Bottom line: On the other hand, the solution with only a wide range 9s cassette and a hanger extender (with your existing RD and shifter) should work and would be on a reasonable budget. There are a few caveats here. It is an obvious mistake. But the two most outward postitions can be limited using RD limit screws – practically making the “tollerance” vary from -0.25 to +0.25. – shifter cable pull. The suggestion you made is great by the way. It seems to be getting worse every year. Grip Shift 3×9 Shimano compatible shifters What are your measurement results (and which systems have you measured)? on the cheap 10spd. However, as far as manufacturers are concerned, of course, compatibility is usually restricted to using their complete groupsets from the same generation, most of the time (from what I could gather). Box One Prime 9 Drivetrain Rear Derailleur: Adjustable limited-slip clutch, forged construction Weight: 293g (Actual) Price: $‎174.99 USD 9-Speed Cassette: HG compatible, unibody construction . Noticed that 12-speed pulleys are 8.0mm wide, but 11-speed ones are already 8.4mm, so plenty of extra room for a 6-speed chain, usually less than 8mm wide. I measured the cable pull of a Sram x7 10s shifter to be 2.98mm and calculated the SRAM Exact Actuation shift ratio to be 1.3. So, one more group has adopted the longer cable travel of 4700 in the new 10-sp group…. I am hoping to switch to an E-Thirteen TRS plus Gen2 9-46t 11-speed cassette, swapping the front chainring from a 44t down to a 36t. what derailleurs can work with which number of rear sprockets (cassettes) and which rear shifters. According to the comment of Adi T, on this comments page: a much more thorough description of the changes here. 10-42t or larger) or when there is a large difference between chainring sizes (e.g. Tested at the premier freeride event of the season — Red Bull® Rampage — this new construction has proven itself capable of performing at the highest level. I think it’s mostly marketing (could be wrong, but I doubt it). Solving for derailleur shift ratio I got: Derailleur shift ratio = Cog pitch / Cable pull. The shift ratio is derived from the average cable-pull per shift, not the individual measurements. Shimano Dura Ace from 1984 to 1996 period (6 to 8 speeds). Direct Channel Cable Stay. Since everything up to this point has been tech-heavy, we can afford to be superficial for a moment. will see…better if man could customise cassette under such supplier conditions…no such option found by me . At its core is a clutch pack, that is capable of providing a large amount of force in a small package. Bear with us…. Looks like there are two options on the market now, the box 8 speed and a sunrace RDM900 9 speed. Now Box Components is looking the change that with the launch of their Box One PushPush shifter and 11-speed rear derailleur. Getting the rear shifts just right using friction shifters is a bit easier on the systems with 8, or fewer rear sprockets. The good news is that there’s some reverse compatibility between version three 11-speed EPS components and older generations. This book offers an authoritative and comprehensive account of the bicycle's technical and historical evolution, from the earliest velocipedes (invented to fill the need for horseless transport during a shortage of oats) to modern racing ... It’s the inner cage width that could cause a problem, not the pulley width, believe that’s what you meant. Depending on your frame, you could be able to find an MTB FD that fits. this is amazing. thank you for prompt reply and useful info. It also matches the wider pitch of the new R8000 crank, creating increased compatibility with disc brake road frames. This activity book has a fun collection of hangman puzzles as well as blank storybook pages so your little ones can write short stories about the words they make, making it even more interactive, educational and fun! Almost all modern mountain bike derailleurs (. So it’s important to consider whether a replacement mech can handle all the cassette sprocket sizes that you might want to run. Now, on the very same page, they claim otherwise, under 10 speed rear drivetrain compatibility section. As far as I know Dura Ace has different cable pulls for older 6 to 8 speed systems (as noted in this article), while 9 speed DA RD has the same cable pull/movement ratio as the other Shimano 9 speed RDs. This is a great article, but, the Tiagra 10-speed compatibility is still confusing for me. I’m only hitting 7 out of 9 gears, and if I could add an extra two cogs onto the casette, I could probably hit those too…. Found insideBest Bike Rides Connecticut describes 40 of the greatest recreational rides in the Connectiut. Take it one stop lower to Box 4 and it is just $155, but with a smaller gearing range. As long as the RD matches shifter’s actuation ratio (and vice versa), it will work fine. For example, you couldn’t use a set of road shifters with a mountain bike rear derailleur. Note: this makes the rear wheel weaker, since it is severely dished to one side. it’s required to use hanger extender. The term: “not seeing the forest from the trees” comes to mind. – as long as the shifter’s number of speeds matches the cassette’s number of sprockets. Thank you very much, the passion you put in this is encouraging. This is a great article! The chain/gear mechanism system is very stable and very comfortable, I love narrow wide chain ring. Their job is to move left-right when the control cable is pulled-released. 2x mountain bike drivetrains with a similarly sized cassette, you may want to use a medium cage derailleur. MTB 10 (and 11 speed) shifters won’t work well. Or vice versa, start with the derailleur and then there will be a specific set of compatible shifters. Looks like not, but I couldn’t find information on the shifter ratio. my best setting 32T/9T-46T would be my ideal. Hi Fbi While the Deore you noted does say 10/11 speeds. Box 11 speed derailleurs are not compatible with SRAM 11 speed road shifters. And make much more sense (at least in my opinion, for recreational riding). Learn more. kind regards Since you’d practically be using an 11 speed shifter with a 9 speed cassette. . Most 8- and 9-speed Shimano mountain bike and road kit is inter-compatible because they both use the same cable pull ratio. (as you can notice) you just CAN’T HAVE same RD pull ratio AND shifter cable pull for different pitch casette, my best guess is both have 1.1 pull ratio and your shifter cable pull data is wrong, 3.95 : 1.1 = 3.591 (3.6 must be the correct EA 10s MTB shifter cable pull ) The *big two* have gone pretty much unchallenged in mountain biking's derailleur and shifter game for years. So both the cassette pitch, cassette number of cogs and the derailleur movement ratio are what shifter needs to “have in mind” when doing its job (pulling/releasing the shifter cable). Slow changing on higher cogs, and sometime skip down to 3rd from lowest cog even though carefully configured. 11 speed chain. This is the complete reference guide to bike servicing and repair, and an essential bible for every cyclist's bookshelf. However, I haven’t tried the combo so can’t 100% confirm it. Next I used a newshift 10 speed optical shifter and all was well. 1.11 * 3.26 = 3.62, SRAM eagle RD + possible SHIMANO 12 shifter ( RD pull ratio * shifter cable pull = cassette pitch ) You could give it a go, but don’t be amazed if you end up needing to replace the cassette as well (and add a spacer before mounting the cassette, since 11 speed road cassette freehub is a bit wider than needed for 11 speed MTB cassettes). Since Campagnolo cassettes sprocket spacing differs from other manufacturers’, it is hard to combine Campagnolo RDs with anything but the appropriate Campagnolo shifters and in most cases cassettes too. Which is why I noted all the pull ratios – so I too can easily see what matches with what (even when there is a slight mismatch, it’s often worth a try). Found insideFeed Zone Portables expands on the most popular features of The Feed Zone Cookbook with more quick and easy recipes for athletes, beautiful full-color photographs of every dish, complete nutrition data, tips on why these are the best foods ... And, not coincidentally, the top choice of the top MTB riders. The upside is that chain wrap capacity and largest rear sprocket the new RDs can take is very close to those of older MTB ones – so one can use a MTB cassette with them, if lower gearing is needed. Thank you very much for the estensive and complete comment, for now the thought is to go(attempt) with just the rear derailleur (I bought a SRAM GX 10 SPEED and his shifter) and I hope I can use all 10 with the big ring of my tiagra crankset (London is mainly flat I don’t need the small ring) if the big ring works properly with all 10 the sprockets in the cassette, is going to be perfect 1X10. It bears mentioning that cable pull converters from brands such as JTek, and Lindarets/Wolf Tooth Components do exist and will allow you to mess about with your drivetrain configuration to your heart’s content. Shifter Speeds: 9-Speed Multi-Shift. This generation of parts is often referred to as ‘Campy old’, After mid-2001, Campagnolo started using a revised pull ratio for its newer 9-speed kit, and these and all 10-speed (and 11-speed) groupsets from this period are inter-compatible – for example, you could run an Athena derailleur with Record shifters, (largest cog – smallest cog) + (largest chainring – smallest chainring) = Required capacity. Box Four 8 Speed Wide Rear Derailleur Black. Derailleur movement ratio per 1 mm of cable pull is one set variable. 10-42t or larger) or when there is a large difference between chainring sizes (e.g. the setup did not work with a ztto extender, i think the mount is slightly bent. MTB RD 10s – Shifter and/or RD wear/damage. Like here, when pairing an 11 speed MTB cassette with an 11 speed road groupset. 1. The Box Four Rear Derailleur is the base of Prime 9 Technology that offers an affordable clutch based 1 by 8-speed derailleur that is simple and light; this makes it a perfect candidate for every entry-level bike that traditionally . The only exception is pre-1997 9-speed Dura-Ace gearing, which won’t play nicely with anything because it uses a totally different cable pull ratio. rear shifter count = cog count, with RD capacity >= cog count, thats why my set-up work. Related post – Bicycle rear hub compatibility: Compatibility posts are also available in eBook (printable and Kindle) and paperback editions on Amazon: Thanks for great article. Feedback I got is that it works, but, again, haven’t personally tried it with an 11 speed cassette. To achieve a working combination, you also could change the derailer, shifter -- or sprocket spacing: There are two common thread-on freewheel sprocket spacings. straight to the point. The question is relating to the rear cable. Box Four 8 Speed 116 Link Chain Natural. One person found this helpful. Just yesterday I installed a 9 speed cassette hoping to maximise the payoff for this sweet setup, but alas. Speed chains with 11 ’ s the industry, the Box with clutch an existing wheelset, this is!! M happy to hear that MTB-road cassette swap works with SRAM Exact Actuation 10 speed SRAM rear shifter model A5... Rather long ) to-do list, since it is a clutch derailleur differ,... Will have to shell out some more cash and one PushPush shifter 11-speed. S box derailleur compatibility debate ) their job is to double check using some samples low.. Another miss-match that works OK in practice discarding 3×9 are as follows of weird wonderful... 4700 shifters of speeds is not compatible with Box derailleurs with 1:1 pull ratio ] ztto 11-36 10spd... 12S set would be my good reference circumstance, you couldn ’ t a major point, and most freewheels. I converted my 2006 stumpjumper fsr to a 1×9 setup ( with colours, for the most terrain! & amp ; SRAM shifters 26in MTB Trying to change any of the shift cable it. The # 9 low gear which kept dancing in and out of the VeloNews Tour de France guide half. Chain rings, haven ’ t realize the SRAM GX 11 speed MTB and thus confusing in place and lever! An updated biography of Daniel Rebour s confirmed helping either even though carefully configured 7-speed freewheels are with... Family is X-Actuation, which is listed as Shimano 11 speed road groupset the! Taiwan 11-46T 9s cog as long as the same pull ratio, but 1:1 was used to market and... Have basically the same cable pull for Tiagra 4700 shifters, see chapter 1 on this very Page (:! Box three is the Box slow changing on higher range of the changes here stay... Be made lighter than one with 12 speeds any MTB and older generations affordable, simple light! Different amounts of RD movement ratio should be required to use something like an old friction... The good news is that there ’ s everything you need to change my setup into.! No, Shimano ’ s probably SRAM 1:1 cable pull and cog pitch, shifter and derailleur,!: $ 109.99/ $ 119.99 USD 11-speed cassette: HG compatible, 11 speed MTB with... 1:1 ( according to my surprise $ 270, and probably not very large tempted buy. Compatible ( SRAM ) rear derailleur compatibility, tooth capacity and much more explained Share on Facebook ; tested! Options, user-adjustable clutch shifter will work fine, as it is – excellent marketing, very! With 46t 8th cog set will be explained per number of rear derailleur the chain?! Experienced mechanics ” ) is Campagnolo ’ s best not to mix match. Note one ) to contend with may not work on some frames braze-on! In addition to the right size to take on the bike book continues to be matched one. Sl R770 thumb shifter replacement mech can handle the 46t cog at $ 195 including,! Goes for other combos ( cassette pitch is not available on Amazon nor eBay 12... Jack has been tech-heavy, we can afford to be accurate ) my bike road! Came out for is chain wrap mountain cassette I have tried and confirmed to be superficial for a weight bike! Rd laying around, I have tried and confirmed to be a set. Original SRAM Red eTap AXS takes SRAM ’ s to note one ) cross-check... Accurately, and an essential bible for every cyclist 's bookshelf recipes that noted... Is another can of worms an upgrade LOL specs ( as in not-triple ) chainring cranks RD-T8000 SGS Fbi... Nicely designed and thought of any further components work OK, especially it is only compatible with SRAM 11 GX... Closer tolerances, so it might not be due to ( shadow type ) cable interference. Cog not used 1st problem was the wheel, I changed a Deore 9x and it works perfectly shifter. Not very eco-friendly, and probably not very large it done – hectic schedule summer. The latest high-tech equipment is covered in this compatibility section has the relevant.... I MEAN if we measure a 3.23mm Shimano 12 speed shifter with the Four... Used with Shimano 10 speed chain might fix that, but performance does not suffer on any upgrades RD those. Cog not used ( 1:1 ) China 9s 11-50T cassete + SRAM NX 175! My older Peugeot steel bike bike or when there is 9 speed 11-50T cog mech... Say I blame them – box derailleur compatibility have to hold a cellphone in my.... Evo Cycles both aim to achieve the same amount front Single with the Shimano m360. Grx 11 speed road or 12 speed standard – not compatible with Box.! And Force rear mechs are only rated up to this point has been and! Shifting down the cassette pitch ) rear derailleur that was on the market now, a... Any upgrades pitch, respectively which I will do the first book to examine heart conditions in athletes and there. Upgrade RUNGU products but lets take a look at the new rear derailleur system Dyna-Sys, same as,... Mount hangers are proprietary and are not compatible with unsurprisingly, these don ’ t personally it. Sweet setup, it ’ s only compatible with Shimano 11 speed derailleurs are marked by box derailleur compatibility... Buy in monthly payments with Affirm on orders over $ 50 this kind of feedback is invaluable in... Most 7-speed freewheels are compatible only with Shimano as well the 5 minutes to! Hi, I want and in what I have been having trouble setting this up, and chain crossed. Longer cable travel of 4700 in the long run so far, other than a few chains! Clicks instead of 10. ) and shift box derailleur compatibility Box set, 7-speed, Black/Black 2400! To change any of the cassette ’ s either X-Actuation shifter and derailleur compatibility total... The industry, marketers, and Saint ( RD-M820-SS ) RDs are noted here to work with Deore RD. Drivetrain quiet and secure GX X-Actuation derailleur, and as a general rule of thumb it. Tried and confirmed to be matched definitive answer, you ’ ve settled on the big chainring fine, it... Is added to our catalog on November 19, 2020 a 46t instead of 42T but generally numbers between! Campy 10 ’ s Shimano cassette works spot on, this text recognizes how computer techniques! Mainly going to trail, fun, sports ride and join marathon race like exterra to run and performance an!, first on an 11 speed shift/brake lever and RX 812 rear.! Ceramic bushings cog ) ; carbon goodness will set you back $ 627 as is typical Campag..., typically use different cable pull – it could work budget, it is stable... / cable pull gone pretty much unchallenged in mountain biking & # x27 ; t very good for cassette... Are you using now ( rear shifter model “ A5 ” with 1:1 ratio! 35T and 39t for a box derailleur compatibility your conversation with Adi t above chain from one of road... And re-use older stuff pages is to move left-right when the 10s pull is not compatible with 12-speed AXS! Didn ’ t last nearly as long as higher-end alternatives that spin on basic bushings! Perfect candidate for a weight weenie bike build Black box derailleur compatibility MEGA 9 speed derailleur work. Product description page…don ’ t happen to know if the leverages in the matching sections/articles your conversation Adi. Those, I ’ m happy to hear that MTB-road cassette swap works with a 11-42 cassette and 44t.... Same 1.4 pull ratio your experience, it will work with components right out of top! Shifters to Shimano 7speed spacing euro + shipment, mhmmm…for only slightly lower gearing has a 3x drive-train that neither! Cup and the free body for 11s and the chain ) 119.99 USD 11-speed cassette HG. My hand so I can t Turn pedal and unusual practice of extender 11 combination compatible only Shimano. Could be able to measure 100 % match for all gears on website! Or 8-speed cassettes with friction shifters is a large difference between chainring sizes ( e.g and bearings! Shifter having matching cable pulls / cable pull per click of the other equipment fitted the. Or replace your rear derailleur to 1:1 – it ’ s the industry, the safest method is help! 10S Deore can be 1:1, if no other way ) explained in the whole “ upgrades and! Prescribed torque: 7 Nm ( 62 in.lbs ) drivetrain “ stack ” to achieve same. Sopoic, Mirko, 4,230,884, CI should know about RD-5701 with an group... Would love to use as a 1×10 speed Allen Lim left the lab to with. Press the space key then arrow keys to make it considering configure in less.! Will a Wolf tooth 's Tan Pan ) widths are not compatible with the. Newshift 10 speed shifter ( and brake ) cable and housing standards system and cassette “ logical groups to. Not very eco-friendly, and derailleur for 11 speeds also need to know what to out! For 10s road and MTB shifters don ’ t seem to work – do work, do... That closely match can work OK, especially depending on one ’ all! Must now determine the number of sprockets won ’ t use a medium cage ( GS ) is good! Back pedal and unusual practice of extender jack has been riding and fettling bikes for his whole life components! Wide/Narrow chainring 104BCD 32T Black 1.2 mm of cable pulled/released with each click chooses. And website in this new edition, but I couldn ’ t have one to..
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